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GX 200
Aug 6, 2009 17:10:46 GMT -5
Post by Brad Wunder on Aug 6, 2009 17:10:46 GMT -5
What would you guys think about a Honda GX200 racing with the clones?
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GX 200
Aug 6, 2009 17:49:06 GMT -5
Post by brad42 on Aug 6, 2009 17:49:06 GMT -5
I say throw a set of clone valvesprings in it and go racing. The GX200 is the original Honda design that the "Clones" are copies of. But I am not in the clone class so my opinion does not count even a little bit
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GX 200
Aug 6, 2009 17:57:26 GMT -5
Post by Brad Wunder on Aug 6, 2009 17:57:26 GMT -5
I say throw a set of clone valvesprings in it and go racing. The GX200 is the original Honda design that the "Clones" are copies of. But I am not in the clone class so my opinion does not count even a little bit That's basically where I'm coming from on this as well Brad42. The reason I'm asking is Gary pointed a new 4 cycle karter our way by giving him my phone number. We had a nice long conversation last night. He and his son (17) are new to karting and he had a ton of questions. He originally bought a clone (from Emmick I think) but took to back and bought a GX 200. I explained that the clone is based off the 200 but I wasn't motor savvy enough to say if there are significant enough differences in the motors to preclude him from running with the clones. Figured I'd throw it out here and see what the BSC pilots thought. Either way, looks like we've got a couple more new drivers coming into the fold. Only question is, are they going to get another kart so they can both go racing at the same time (they only have one at the moment)? And what motor package will they ultimately be running.
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GX 200
Aug 6, 2009 21:41:50 GMT -5
Post by Dan Chase on Aug 6, 2009 21:41:50 GMT -5
The GX 200 would not be legal under AKRA racing rules. IMO, the Honda would be like running a blueprinted clone, that is why guys were swapping out honda flywheels, cams and carbs in the early days of the clone before the $200 claiming rule.
As far as I know, all of the Dixon racers have agreed to follow the AKRA rules with the possible exception of a tire rule. I'm all for bringing as many people in to the clones as we can, but not at the expense of breaking the spirit of the rules.
As a side note, I went to the 1/4 midget race on Saturday after the gold rush, I was a little disheartened to find out that they had upped the claiming price to well over double what it was and now $1200 blue printed Hondas are the order of the day. Made me kind of sick after all the hard work a group of us put in to keep the Honda affordable.
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duffy
Full Member
Posts: 205
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GX 200
Aug 7, 2009 9:21:07 GMT -5
Post by duffy on Aug 7, 2009 9:21:07 GMT -5
Posted by Brad Wunder on Yesterday " What would you guys think about a Honda GX200 racing with the clones? " After reading what Dan Chase wrote about the GX200. " The GX 200 would NOT be legal under AKRA racing rules." We should not bend the rules for this engine or any others. lets keep it the way it is right now. It seems that we have something in the works now and lets make it work. I say keep the clones as they are right now. Stock out of the box. only making the changes that we have all talked about and we are doing at this point. I'm with you Dan Chase and the Dixon Guys who have clones, I say NO to the GX200.
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GX 200
Aug 7, 2009 11:00:48 GMT -5
Post by Brad Wunder on Aug 7, 2009 11:00:48 GMT -5
No question that a GX 200 would not be a legal motor in the clone class. I don't think Ward is worried about running for points, trophies etc. etc. He just wants to be able to go out and race. He and his son are complete novices when it comes to karting. Had he had at little more info (or known that he could use the NFRA as a resource) he probably would have kept his clone. As it is now, he is sort of stuck on the outside looking in with no place to race.
Initially posting this question here was probably a mistake. I should have thrown this up on the main board as it isn't really a "clone" issue. His motor is actually closer to an F200 but just not built to that spec. I suggested that he keep his GX, buy a clone for the short term and then if he wanted to go faster down the road he could build his GX up to F200 specs. I guess the real question is, if he shows up to the track at a race, can he race with us even though he doesn't technically fit into any of our motor classes? Personally, I say the more the merrier! As long as he understands that he won't be eligible for any awards/points until he has a legal motor for whichever class he and his son decide to go with. Heck, he may even decide to go the WF route. LOL Just my 2 cents.
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duffy
Full Member
Posts: 205
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GX 200
Aug 7, 2009 11:13:33 GMT -5
Post by duffy on Aug 7, 2009 11:13:33 GMT -5
Brad W. As you know, I'm the 1st to say lets race and have fun. I welcome Ward and his son with open arms to race with us on the track. If they show up at the track I say let them race, But not in the clone class with the GX 200. And as you said Brad the more the merrier! You know how I feel. I want everyone to race and have fun. Invite them to the track.
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GX 200
Aug 7, 2009 11:15:55 GMT -5
Post by norcalacr on Aug 7, 2009 11:15:55 GMT -5
Sure let them run with the clones but not collect "points". That's how NFRA grew from just an F200 group to what it is today.
As a side note: Based on intent I agree with the interpretation of no Hondas. However the rules as posted on Bob's 4 cycle don't specify engine brand so the Honda is legal. The $200 claimer rule would make using the Honda a bad choice financially but still a legal one. I suggest whatever version we settle on states no Hondas.
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GX 200
Aug 7, 2009 14:01:17 GMT -5
Post by karlznet on Aug 7, 2009 14:01:17 GMT -5
Kelly Cunningham's boy wants to run a GX with us too, just for starters to get some seat time. You may have seen his Honda engine sitting on Jason's table at the PC GR race. I vote to let em run for fun, at least for the rest of this season. Start at the back of the grid, no points, no trophy.
Just to clear things up concerning the AKRA rules posted on Bob's, the only true approved engine is the Yellow Clone that has been checked over and has a blue seal attached. Note the seal does not actually "seal" anything. This engine is what's known as a BSP or Box Stock Project engine and will also have BSP stickers affixed. So the Honda GX is not legal under AKRA rules but then neither are the Blue Harbor Freights, or any other colored OHV clone engine for that matter.
As Dan Chase mentioned Kinsmen basically adopted the AKRA rules but with addition of the following clone engines listed below:
MFG: Jiang Dong - Lifan - Zongshen
MODELS: 6.5hp 196cc OHV Engine (168 Series)
COLORS: Red, Blue, Yellow, Black
Also rebadged and sold under the following names;
BS (Box Stock) Central Machinery Northern Tools Carroll Stream Motors Greyhound Baja Blue Max
This left the engine options pretty open while omitting the big block 210cc clone and the Champion Power Products (Costco / Pep Boys) engine with the roller style rockers.
Other then our local option tire rule a few other small changes, actually additions were made to the original rules before submitting to WKA for their approval. The additions were as follows; kill switch must remain functional, engine drain plug must be safety wired and must have a catch bottle off the breather / vent tube.
~Karl
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duffy
Full Member
Posts: 205
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GX 200
Aug 7, 2009 14:36:22 GMT -5
Post by duffy on Aug 7, 2009 14:36:22 GMT -5
I need to make myself clear about the guys with the GX 200. I vote to let them race and have fun, Heck yes. Have some fun.. But just not as a clone,
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Dean
New Member
Posts: 44
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GX 200
Aug 7, 2009 16:49:49 GMT -5
Post by Dean on Aug 7, 2009 16:49:49 GMT -5
Just my opinion but if there is three of them why not have a Honda GX200 class ??
Dean
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GX 200
Aug 7, 2009 18:03:27 GMT -5
Post by Brad Wunder on Aug 7, 2009 18:03:27 GMT -5
Good point Dean. I think there are only two of them though. Hmmmm, there was another GX 200 running out at PC in June but I didn't catch his name or contact info.
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GX 200
Aug 7, 2009 22:58:20 GMT -5
Post by Dan Chase on Aug 7, 2009 22:58:20 GMT -5
Yes, agreed, if he just wants to run with clones, by all means, I have no problem with that, as long as it's not an allowed clone engine.
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GX 200
Aug 10, 2009 0:04:57 GMT -5
Post by mikeduff101 on Aug 10, 2009 0:04:57 GMT -5
i have a question if u could anwser it brad why did he change to the honda if he already had clone as we know they are very reliable motors with very few problems
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GX 200
Aug 10, 2009 10:10:50 GMT -5
Post by Brad Wunder on Aug 10, 2009 10:10:50 GMT -5
Well my sense is he bought a clone, took it to Emmick to have all the necessary stuff done to it and felt they weren't being fair (my words not his) with him. At that point he took the clone back and bought the GX that he could essentially bolt onto his kart.
Had he been aware that he could use the drivers of the NFRA as a resource for what he needed to do to his clone I suspect he never would have bought the GX.
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